Urantia Book Forum

Urantia Book Discussion Board : Study Group
It is currently Wed May 21, 2025 8:11 pm +0000

The TruthBook forum will no longer accept new posts. Please continue to read, search, and enjoy all posts made to prior October 28. No login is needed now to access the valuable resource, so it is open to everyone! For more information, please click HERE.


All times are UTC - 7 hours




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 942 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63  Next
Author Message
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
shrimpythai wrote:
oh yah - I have a question
so if Christ /Michael came to earth to be Jesus - and did get rid of Satan when he was done and resurrected - so all the evil going on in the world now is all from bad human nature?

been thinking about this for a few weeks now

hmmm
let me know


Just weeks??? 5-5-5 (HA-HA-HA) :wink: :lol:

Actually....evil is considered to be the errors of ignorance, inexperience, self importance, immaturity, and lack of wisdom..

And sin is the intentional choosing of what we know is wrong but we decide to do anyway...intentionality.

The "human nature" is really Divine and is defined by the Adjutants of Worship and Wisdom which humans are connected to but animals are not. By that connection humans/mortals have Deity Connections by personality, Holy Spirit, Cosmic Mind, Spirit of Truth, and the Adjuster (God Fragment).

8)

101:3.17 (1108.16) We know, then, by three phenomena, that man has a divine spirit or spirits dwelling within him: first, by personal experience—religious faith; second, by revelation—personal and racial; and third, by the amazing exhibition of such extraordinary and unnatural reactions to his material environment as are illustrated by the foregoing recital of twelve spiritlike performances in the presence of the actual and trying situations of real human existence. And there are still others.

101:3.18 (1109.1) And it is just such a vital and vigorous performance of faith in the domain of religion that entitles mortal man to affirm the personal possession and spiritual reality of that crowning endowment of human nature, religious experience.

16:7.1 (192. Intelligence alone cannot explain the moral nature. Morality, virtue, is indigenous to human personality. Moral intuition, the realization of duty, is a component of human mind endowment and is associated with the other inalienables of human nature: scientific curiosity and spiritual insight. Man’s mentality far transcends that of his animal cousins, but it is his moral and religious natures that especially distinguish him from the animal world.

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
Most of the evil in the world is due to self importance and selfishness and ego domination and false liberty. These are more animalistic than human I think.

The Lucifer rebellion and the legacy of our Planetary Prince's iniquities and the resulting planetary isolation certainly do have an effect. But freewill and inexperience and immaturity are the primary causes of human suffering. This is well known to many prior to and regardless of the UB confirmation of this fact and truth.

Suffering is primarily self inflicted on humanity by humanity. Learning the causes of suffering and having motives and priorities based on true liberty and loving service which reduce and prevent suffering is an experiential wisdom that must be learned.

There can be no delivery from this requirement of evolutionary progress.

8)

53:8.9 (610.5) In general, when weak and dissolute mortals are supposed to be under the influence of devils and demons, they are merely being dominated by their own inherent and debased tendencies, being led away by their own natural propensities. The devil has been given a great deal of credit for evil which does not belong to him. Caligastia has been comparatively impotent since the cross of Christ.

8)

89:10.2 (984.5) Sin must be redefined as deliberate disloyalty to Deity. There are degrees of disloyalty: the partial loyalty of indecision; the divided loyalty of confliction; the dying loyalty of indifference; and the death of loyalty exhibited in devotion to godless ideals.

89:10.3 (984.6) The sense or feeling of guilt is the consciousness of the violation of the mores; it is not necessarily sin. There is no real sin in the absence of conscious disloyalty to Deity.

89:10.4 (984.7) The possibility of the recognition of the sense of guilt is a badge of transcendent distinction for mankind. It does not mark man as mean but rather sets him apart as a creature of potential greatness and ever-ascending glory. Such a sense of unworthiness is the initial stimulus that should lead quickly and surely to those faith conquests which translate the mortal mind to the superb levels of moral nobility, cosmic insight, and spiritual living; thus are all the meanings of human existence changed from the temporal to the eternal, and all values are elevated from the human to the divine.

89:10.5 (984.8) The confession of sin is a manful repudiation of disloyalty, but it in no wise mitigates the time-space consequences of such disloyalty. But confession—sincere recognition of the nature of sin—is essential to religious growth and spiritual progress.

89:10.6 (985.1) The forgiveness of sin by Deity is the renewal of loyalty relations following a period of the human consciousness of the lapse of such relations as the consequence of conscious rebellion. The forgiveness does not have to be sought, only received as the consciousness of re-establishment of loyalty relations between the creature and the Creator. And all the loyal sons of God are happy, service-loving, and ever-progressive in the Paradise ascent.

8)

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
A fascinating paradox to me, as presented in the Papers, is the function of fear to create evolutionary religion, while faith itself delivers us from fear. Revelation and revelatory religion and science all reinforce human faith to reduce and eliminate fear.

Uncertainty is not the source of fear. Uncertainty is adventure itself!! But religious truth and faith are required to eliminate fear from uncertainties.

Hmmm......

:idea: :wink: O:) 8)

26:5.3 (291.3) That, then, is the primary or elementary course which confronts the faith-tested and much-traveled pilgrims of space. But long before reaching Havona, these ascendant children of time have learned to feast upon uncertainty, to fatten upon disappointment, to enthuse over apparent defeat, to invigorate in the presence of difficulties, to exhibit indomitable courage in the face of immensity, and to exercise unconquerable faith when confronted with the challenge of the inexplicable. Long since, the battle cry of these pilgrims became: “In liaison with God, nothing—absolutely nothing—is impossible.”

8)

39:5.7 (437.6) 4. The Spirits of Trust. Suspicion is the inherent reaction of primitive men; the survival struggles of the early ages do not naturally breed trust. Trust is a new human acquisition brought about by the ministry of these planetary seraphim of the Adamic regime. It is their mission to inculcate trust into the minds of evolving men. The Gods are very trustful; the Universal Father is willing freely to trust himself—the Adjuster—to man’s association.

39:5.8 (438.1) This entire group of seraphim was transferred to the new regime after the Adamic miscarriage, and they have ever since continued their labors on Urantia. And they have not been wholly unsuccessful since a civilization is now evolving which embodies much of their ideals of confidence and trust.

39:5.9 (438.2) In the more advanced planetary ages these seraphim enhance man’s appreciation of the truth that uncertainty is the secret of contented continuity. They help the mortal philosophers to realize that, when ignorance is essential to success, it would be a colossal blunder for the creature to know the future. They heighten man’s taste for the sweetness of uncertainty, for the romance and charm of the indefinite and unknown future.

8)

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
Bradley - ok just wanted to confirm that all the evil in the world now - is not from outside "bad angels and demons" but is in fact bad humans - since Micheal/Christ came down to earth
good stuff ! ! !


53:8.9 (610.5) In general, when weak and dissolute mortals are supposed to be under the influence of devils and demons, they are merely being dominated by their own inherent and debased tendencies, being led away by their own natural propensities. The devil has been given a great deal of credit for evil which does not belong to him. Caligastia has been comparatively impotent since the cross of Christ.
39:5.9 (438.2) In the more advanced planetary ages these seraphim enhance man’s appreciation of the truth that uncertainty is the secret of contented continuity. They help the mortal philosophers to realize that, when ignorance is essential to success, it would be a colossal blunder for the creature to know the future. They heighten man’s taste for the sweetness of uncertainty, for the romance and charm of the indefinite and unknown future.

Most of the evil in the world is due to self importance and selfishness and ego domination and false liberty. These are more animalistic than human I think.

The Lucifer rebellion and the legacy of our Planetary Prince's iniquities and the resulting planetary isolation certainly do have an effect. But freewill and inexperience and immaturity are the primary causes of human suffering. This is well known to many prior to and regardless of the UB confirmation of this fact and truth.

Suffering is primarily self inflicted on humanity by humanity. Learning the causes of suffering and having motives and priorities based on true liberty and loving service which reduce and prevent suffering is an experiential wisdom that must be learned.

There can be no delivery from this requirement of evolutionary progress.

The "human nature" is really Divine and is defined by the Adjutants of Worship and Wisdom which humans are connected to but animals are not. By that connection humans/mortals have Deity Connections by personality, Holy Spirit, Cosmic Mind, Spirit of Truth, and the Adjuster (God Fragment).


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
Steve - our one time Prince, Caligastia, still roams our world. I am sure he still causes mischief and certainly opposes those now in charge of our world's evolutionary progress. The rebellion is over. There are no evil or fallen or "bad angels and demons" anywhere on or around Urantia or anywhere in the local system or universe except those few leaders of the System rebellion imprisoned until redemption or adjudications.

No evil being can enter mortal minds or coerce or manipulate mortals into decisions or acts against our will. Can we "go down to the Crossroads and make a deal with the Devil"??? I don't know. Perhaps so. But he's alone now. Why would he make a deal with me? He has no reason to collect souls for hell, as no such place exists.

Human suffering is pretty much caused by humans. Always is. Even before Michael's bestowal.

TruthBook topic "Suffering":

https://forum.truthbook.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5731

From that topic:

"This topic unites the Eastern and Western perspective and philosophies and is a key factor for all believers in all religions throughout history....and today. The Urantia Papers are replete in their presentations on the causes, meaning, value, and solution to suffering too. Suffering is originally and designedly for our primitive ancestors who would do nothing at all unless and until suffering from hunger or cold or attack. We are told our ancestors did not even think until hungry.

Suffering led to invention and activity and cooperation and specialization and collective action and many, many evolutionary advancements over thousands of generations from hunters to gatherers to agriculture to home building to villages to walled towns to skills and trades to religion to governance, etc. The solution to suffering has been the greatest of all drivers of progress in human history. Still is today in fact. Society is structured upon suffering avoidance as is religion.

We are told that we reap what we sow and what goes around comes around. This is the lesson on self inflicted pain and suffering. It also introduces the basic and foundational element of freewill choice as the very source of suffering. Foolish choices result in bad outcomes. But we all know fools and thieves and brutes and bullies who appear to thrive and profit from their foolishness. So karma either is not real or does not work effectively or fairly! Or the reciprocations of karma are unrelated to the material aspects of reaping what we sow.

The UB tells us that Newton's law of physics where every action results in a reaction is also true of freewill choices. Our choices deliver results. Choices are causes. These causes have effects. There are some benign effects to benign or ordinary choices which have nothing to do with conscience, ethics, morality, self importance, the domination of or unrighteous domination of another being, or the spirit within but all of those types of choices reflect our spiritization and spiritual progress.

How do we react and respond to situation, circumstance, relationship, disappointment, failure, confusion, and decision that involves conscience, ethics, morality, religious experience, and the self?

Why do innocents suffer at the hands of others? Why is there cruelty? Why doesn't God stop it? Does God cause it? Such victims did not choose to suffer thusly so freewill has nothing to do with it, right? Does suffering benefit us somehow? If so, then how? When does suffering end? How does it end? When? Is there suffering in heaven? Does anyone ever suffer forever? What is the cure for suffering?

These are some of the questions we might consider as we dive into the Papers in discovery of what they teach us on this universal issue that touches us and the ones we love. I look forward to the thoughts and experiences and text posts of all who are interested.

Let us begin with these facts and teachings: God does not cause our suffering or wish for us to suffer and offers each of us and all of us the solution to all suffering and the way to and means of happiness and joy and all the fruits of the Spirit...and does so in this life and no matter the amount or the source of our suffering. Glory Be!!"

Bradly. 8)

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
Paper 86 which we study now (and Papers 85-92) describes our planetary progression, by evolutionary process, through suffering the consequences of error and self importance and immaturity and ignorance and superstitions. We reap what we sow . We learn to sow different seed for different outcomes.

We have done so without a loyal Prince and Planetary Capital of Life Sciences led by a dedicated and skilled staff visible to us humans. And without the Garden and a global Capital of Culture and Arts. Imagine such a world!!

Paper 92

The Later Evolution of Religion

92:0.1 (1003.1) MAN possessed a religion of natural origin as a part of his evolutionary experience long before any systematic revelations were made on Urantia. But this religion of natural origin was, in itself, the product of man’s superanimal endowments. Evolutionary religion arose slowly throughout the millenniums of mankind’s experiential career through the ministry of the following influences operating within, and impinging upon, savage, barbarian, and civilized man:

92:0.2 (1003.2) 1. The adjutant of worship—the appearance in animal consciousness of superanimal potentials for reality perception. This might be termed the primordial human instinct for Deity.

92:0.3 (1003.3) 2. The adjutant of wisdom—the manifestation in a worshipful mind of the tendency to direct its adoration in higher channels of expression and toward ever-expanding concepts of Deity reality.

92:0.4 (1003.4) 3. The Holy Spirit—this is the initial supermind bestowal, and it unfailingly appears in all bona fide human personalities. This ministry to a worship-craving and wisdom-desiring mind creates the capacity to self-realize the postulate of human survival, both in theologic concept and as an actual and factual personality experience.

92:0.5 (1003.5) The co-ordinate functioning of these three divine ministrations is quite sufficient to initiate and prosecute the growth of evolutionary religion. These influences are later augmented by Thought Adjusters, seraphim, and the Spirit of Truth, all of which accelerate the rate of religious development. These agencies have long functioned on Urantia, and they will continue here as long as this planet remains an inhabited sphere. Much of the potential of these divine agencies has never yet had opportunity for expression; much will be revealed in the ages to come as mortal religion ascends, level by level, toward the supernal heights of morontia value and spirit truth.

1. The Evolutionary Nature of Religion

92:1.1 (1003.6) The evolution of religion has been traced from early fear and ghosts down through many successive stages of development, including those efforts first to coerce and then to cajole the spirits. Tribal fetishes grew into totems and tribal gods; magic formulas became modern prayers. Circumcision, at first a sacrifice, became a hygienic procedure.

92:1.2 (1003.7) Religion progressed from nature worship up through ghost worship to fetishism throughout the savage childhood of the races. With the dawn of civilization the human race espoused the more mystic and symbolic beliefs, while now, with approaching maturity, mankind is ripening for the appreciation of real religion, even a beginning of the revelation of truth itself.

92:1.3 (1004.1) Religion arises as a biologic reaction of mind to spiritual beliefs and the environment; it is the last thing to perish or change in a race. Religion is society’s adjustment, in any age, to that which is mysterious. As a social institution it embraces rites, symbols, cults, scriptures, altars, shrines, and temples. Holy water, relics, fetishes, charms, vestments, bells, drums, and priesthoods are common to all religions. And it is impossible entirely to divorce purely evolved religion from either magic or sorcery.

92:1.4 (1004.2) Mystery and power have always stimulated religious feelings and fears, while emotion has ever functioned as a powerful conditioning factor in their development. Fear has always been the basic religious stimulus. Fear fashions the gods of evolutionary religion and motivates the religious ritual of the primitive believers. As civilization advances, fear becomes modified by reverence, admiration, respect, and sympathy and is then further conditioned by remorse and repentance.

92:1.5 (1004.3) One Asiatic people taught that “God is a great fear”; that is the outgrowth of purely evolutionary religion. Jesus, the revelation of the highest type of religious living, proclaimed that “God is love.”

8)

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Last edited by fanofVan on Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:10 am +0000, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
1 John 2:15–17
English Standard Version
Do Not Love the World
15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16 For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and ythe desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.
17 And the world is passing away along with its desires, but whoever does the will of God abides forever.

got this from the movie Fury - also Isaiah 6:8
8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I asend, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
Bradley - ok good stuff - just wanted to confirm this - yep - humans on their own can cause a ton of bad stuff - all on their OWN volition - yep !

ok good stuff - just sad that 200 million plus have died from wars in the last 100 years - from bad humans - have to get higher up the spiritual plane on this planet !
yikes ! ! !



Steve - our one time Prince, Caligastia, still roams our world. I am sure he still causes mischief and certainly opposes those now in charge of our world's evolutionary progress. The rebellion is over. There are no evil or fallen or "bad angels and demons" anywhere on or around Urantia or anywhere in the local system or universe except those few leaders of the System rebellion imprisoned until redemption or adjudications.

No evil being can enter mortal minds or coerce or manipulate mortals into decisions or acts against our will. Can we "go down to the Crossroads and make a deal with the Devil"??? I don't know. Perhaps so. But he's alone now. Why would he make a deal with me? He has no reason to collect souls for hell, as no such place exists.

Human suffering is pretty much caused by humans. Always is. Even before Michael's bestowal.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
interesting bit here on death!

3. Death—The Inexplicable
86:3.1 (952.3) Death was the supreme shock to evolving man, the most perplexing combination of chance and mystery. Not the sanctity of life but the shock of death inspired fear and thus effectively fostered religion. Among savage peoples death was ordinarily due to violence, so that nonviolent death became increasingly mysterious. Death as a natural and expected end of life was not clear to the consciousness of primitive people, and it has required age upon age for man to realize its inevitability.

86:3.2 (952.4) Early man accepted life as a fact, while he regarded death as a visitation of some sort. All races have their legends of men who did not die, vestigial traditions of the early attitude toward death. Already in the human mind there existed the nebulous concept of a hazy and unorganized spirit world, a domain whence came all that is inexplicable in human life, and death was added to this long list of unexplained phenomena.

86:3.3 (952.5) All human disease and natural death was at first believed to be due to spirit influence. Even at the present time some civilized races regard disease as having been produced by “the enemy” and depend upon religious ceremonies to effect healing. Later and more complex systems of theology still ascribe death to the action of the spirit world, all of which has led to such doctrines as original sin and the fall of man.

86:3.4 (952.6) It was the realization of impotency before the mighty forces of nature, together with the recognition of human weakness before the visitations of sickness and death, that impelled the savage to seek for help from the supermaterial world, which he vaguely visualized as the source of these mysterious vicissitudes of life.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
and more good stuff ! the "breath of life" deal

4. The Death-Survival Concept
86:4.1 (952.7) The concept of a supermaterial phase of mortal personality was born of the unconscious and purely accidental association of the occurrences of everyday life plus the ghost dream. The simultaneous dreaming about a departed chief by several members of his tribe seemed to constitute convincing evidence that the old chief had really returned in some form. It was all very real to the savage who would awaken from such dreams reeking with sweat, trembling, and screaming.

86:4.2 (953.1) The dream origin of the belief in a future existence explains the tendency always to imagine unseen things in the terms of things seen. And presently this new dream-ghost-future-life concept began effectively to antidote the death fear associated with the biologic instinct of self-preservation.

86:4.3 (953.2) Early man was also much concerned about his breath, especially in cold climates, where it appeared as a cloud when exhaled. The breath of life was regarded as the one phenomenon which differentiated the living and the dead. He knew the breath could leave the body, and his dreams of doing all sorts of queer things while asleep convinced him that there was something immaterial about a human being. The most primitive idea of the human soul, the ghost, was derived from the breath-dream idea-system.

86:4.4 (953.3) Eventually the savage conceived of himself as a double—body and breath. The breath minus the body equaled a spirit, a ghost. While having a very definite human origin, ghosts, or spirits, were regarded as superhuman. And this belief in the existence of disembodied spirits seemed to explain the occurrence of the unusual, the extraordinary, the infrequent, and the inexplicable.

86:4.5 (953.4) The primitive doctrine of survival after death was not necessarily a belief in immortality. Beings who could not count over twenty could hardly conceive of infinity and eternity; they rather thought of recurring incarnations.

86:4.6 (953.5) The orange race was especially given to belief in transmigration and reincarnation. This idea of reincarnation originated in the observance of hereditary and trait resemblance of offspring to ancestors. The custom of naming children after grandparents and other ancestors was due to belief in reincarnation. Some later-day races believed that man died from three to seven times. This belief (residual from the teachings of Adam about the mansion worlds), and many other remnants of revealed religion, can be found among the otherwise absurd doctrines of twentieth-century barbarians.

86:4.7 (953.6) Early man entertained no ideas of hell or future punishment. The savage looked upon the future life as just like this one, minus all ill luck. Later on, a separate destiny for good ghosts and bad ghosts—heaven and hell—was conceived. But since many primitive races believed that man entered the next life just as he left this one, they did not relish the idea of becoming old and decrepit. The aged much preferred to be killed before becoming too infirm.

86:4.8 (953.7) Almost every group had a different idea regarding the destiny of the ghost soul. The Greeks believed that weak men must have weak souls; so they invented Hades as a fit place for the reception of such anemic souls; these unrobust specimens were also supposed to have shorter shadows. The early Andites thought their ghosts returned to the ancestral homelands. The Chinese and Egyptians once believed that soul and body remained together. Among the Egyptians this led to careful tomb construction and efforts at body preservation. Even modern peoples seek to arrest the decay of the dead. The Hebrews conceived that a phantom replica of the individual went down to Sheol; it could not return to the land of the living. They did make that important advance in the doctrine of the evolution of the soul.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
good info on ghosts-souls !

5. The Ghost-Soul Concept
86:5.1 (953.8) The nonmaterial part of man has been variously termed ghost, spirit, shade, phantom, specter, and latterly soul. The soul was early man’s dream double; it was in every way exactly like the mortal himself except that it was not responsive to touch. The belief in dream doubles led directly to the notion that all things animate and inanimate had souls as well as men. This concept tended long to perpetuate the nature-spirit beliefs; the Eskimos still conceive that everything in nature has a spirit.

86:5.2 (954.1) The ghost soul could be heard and seen, but not touched. Gradually the dream life of the race so developed and expanded the activities of this evolving spirit world that death was finally regarded as “giving up the ghost.” All primitive tribes, except those little above animals, have developed some concept of the soul. As civilization advances, this superstitious concept of the soul is destroyed, and man is wholly dependent on revelation and personal religious experience for his new idea of the soul as the joint creation of the God-knowing mortal mind and its indwelling divine spirit, the Thought Adjuster.

86:5.3 (954.2) Early mortals usually failed to differentiate the concepts of an indwelling spirit and a soul of evolutionary nature. The savage was much confused as to whether the ghost soul was native to the body or was an external agency in possession of the body. The absence of reasoned thought in the presence of perplexity explains the gross inconsistencies of the savage view of souls, ghosts, and spirits.

86:5.4 (954.3) The soul was thought of as being related to the body as the perfume to the flower. The ancients believed that the soul could leave the body in various ways, as in:

86:5.5 (954.4) 1. Ordinary and transient fainting.

86:5.6 (954.5) 2. Sleeping, natural dreaming.

86:5.7 (954.6) 3. Coma and unconsciousness associated with disease and accidents.

86:5.8 (954.7) 4. Death, permanent departure.

86:5.9 (954.8) The savage looked upon sneezing as an abortive attempt of the soul to escape from the body. Being awake and on guard, the body was able to thwart the soul’s attempted escape. Later on, sneezing was always accompanied by some religious expression, such as “God bless you!”
(I always say gesundheit for some reason since I was a kid ...from the doctionary - "This reflects the superstition that a sneeze can cause the soul to fly out of the body; saying the phrase prevents this from happening." praise - didn't know why tho 5 5 5 )

86:5.10 (954.9) Early in evolution sleep was regarded as proving that the ghost soul could be absent from the body, and it was believed that it could be called back by speaking or shouting the sleeper’s name. In other forms of unconsciousness the soul was thought to be farther away, perhaps trying to escape for good—impending death. Dreams were looked upon as the experiences of the soul during sleep while temporarily absent from the body. The savage believes his dreams to be just as real as any part of his waking experience. The ancients made a practice of awaking sleepers gradually so that the soul might have time to get back into the body.

86:5.11 (954.10) All down through the ages men have stood in awe of the apparitions of the night season, and the Hebrews were no exception. They truly believed that God spoke to them in dreams, despite the injunctions of Moses against this idea. And Moses was right, for ordinary dreams are not the methods employed by the personalities of the spiritual world when they seek to communicate with material beings.

86:5.12 (954.11) The ancients believed that souls could enter animals or even inanimate objects. This culminated in the werewolf ideas of animal identification. A person could be a law-abiding citizen by day, but when he fell asleep, his soul could enter a wolf or some other animal to prowl about on nocturnal depredations.

86:5.13 (955.1) Primitive men thought that the soul was associated with the breath, and that its qualities could be imparted or transferred by the breath. The brave chief would breathe upon the newborn child, thereby imparting courage. Among early Christians the ceremony of bestowing the Holy Spirit was accompanied by breathing on the candidates. Said the Psalmist: “By the word of the Lord were the heavens made and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.” It was long the custom of the eldest son to try to catch the last breath of his dying father.

86:5.14 (955.2) The shadow came, later on, to be feared and revered equally with the breath. The reflection of oneself in the water was also sometimes looked upon as proof of the double self, and mirrors were regarded with superstitious awe. Even now many civilized persons turn the mirror to the wall in the event of death. Some backward tribes still believe that the making of pictures, drawings, models, or images removes all or a part of the soul from the body; hence such are forbidden.

86:5.15 (955.3) The soul was generally thought of as being identified with the breath, but it was also located by various peoples in the head, hair, heart, liver, blood, and fat. The “crying out of Abel’s blood from the ground” is expressive of the onetime belief in the presence of the ghost in the blood. The Semites taught that the soul resided in the bodily fat, and among many the eating of animal fat was taboo. Head hunting was a method of capturing an enemy’s soul, as was scalping. In recent times the eyes have been regarded as the windows of the soul.

86:5.16 (955.4) Those who held the doctrine of three or four souls believed that the loss of one soul meant discomfort, two illness, three death. One soul lived in the breath, one in the head, one in the hair, one in the heart. The sick were advised to stroll about in the open air with the hope of recapturing their strayed souls. The greatest of the medicine men were supposed to exchange the sick soul of a diseased person for a new one, the “new birth.”

86:5.17 (955.5) The children of Badonan developed a belief in two souls, the breath and the shadow. The early Nodite races regarded man as consisting of two persons, soul and body. This philosophy of human existence was later reflected in the Greek viewpoint. The Greeks themselves believed in three souls; the vegetative resided in the stomach, the animal in the heart, the intellectual in the head. The Eskimos believe that man has three parts: body, soul, and name.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
interesting stuff !

6. The Ghost-Spirit Environment
86:6.1 (955.6) Man inherited a natural environment, acquired a social environment, and imagined a ghost environment. The state is man’s reaction to his natural environment, the home to his social environment, the church to his illusory ghost environment.

86:6.2 (955.7) Very early in the history of mankind the realities of the imaginary world of ghosts and spirits became universally believed, and this newly imagined spirit world became a power in primitive society. The mental and moral life of all mankind was modified for all time by the appearance of this new factor in human thinking and acting.

86:6.3 (955.8) Into this major premise of illusion and ignorance, mortal fear has packed all of the subsequent superstition and religion of primitive peoples. This was man’s only religion up to the times of revelation, and today many of the world’s races have only this crude religion of evolution.

86:6.4 (955.9) As evolution progressed, good luck became associated with good spirits and bad luck with bad spirits. The discomfort of enforced adaptation to a changing environment was regarded as ill luck, the displeasure of the spirit ghosts. Primitive man slowly evolved religion out of his innate worship urge and his misconception of chance. Civilized man provides schemes of insurance to overcome these chance occurrences; modern science puts an actuary with mathematical reckoning in the place of fictitious spirits and whimsical gods.

86:6.5 (956.1) Each passing generation smiles at the foolish superstitions of its ancestors while it goes on entertaining those fallacies of thought and worship which will give cause for further smiling on the part of enlightened posterity.

86:6.6 (956.2) But at last the mind of primitive man was occupied with thoughts which transcended all of his inherent biologic urges; at last man was about to evolve an art of living based on something more than response to material stimuli. The beginnings of a primitive philosophic life policy were emerging. A supernatural standard of living was about to appear, for, if the spirit ghost in anger visits ill luck and in pleasure good fortune, then must human conduct be regulated accordingly. The concept of right and wrong had at last evolved; and all of this long before the times of any revelation on earth.

86:6.7 (956.3) With the emergence of these concepts, there was initiated the long and wasteful struggle to appease the ever-displeased spirits, the slavish bondage to evolutionary religious fear, that long waste of human effort upon tombs, temples, sacrifices, and priesthoods. It was a terrible and frightful price to pay, but it was worth all it cost, for man therein achieved a natural consciousness of relative right and wrong; human ethics was born!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
Ah-Ha - good stuff !

7. The Function of Primitive Religion
86:7.1 (956.4) The savage felt the need of insurance, and he therefore willingly paid his burdensome premiums of fear, superstition, dread, and priest gifts toward his policy of magic insurance against ill luck. Primitive religion was simply the payment of premiums on insurance against the perils of the forests; civilized man pays material premiums against the accidents of industry and the exigencies of modern modes of living.

86:7.2 (956.5) Modern society is removing the business of insurance from the realm of priests and religion, placing it in the domain of economics. Religion is concerning itself increasingly with the insurance of life beyond the grave. Modern men, at least those who think, no longer pay wasteful premiums to control luck. Religion is slowly ascending to higher philosophic levels in contrast with its former function as a scheme of insurance against bad luck.

86:7.3 (956.6) But these ancient ideas of religion prevented men from becoming fatalistic and hopelessly pessimistic; they believed they could at least do something to influence fate. The religion of ghost fear impressed upon men that they must regulate their conduct, that there was a supermaterial world which was in control of human destiny.
ah-ha - very good !

86:7.4 (956.7) Modern civilized races are just emerging from ghost fear as an explanation of luck and the commonplace inequalities of existence. Mankind is achieving emancipation from the bondage of the ghost-spirit explanation of ill luck. But while men are giving up the erroneous doctrine of a spirit cause of the vicissitudes of life, they exhibit a surprising willingness to accept an almost equally fallacious teaching which bids them attribute all human inequalities to political misadaptation, social injustice, and industrial competition. But new legislation, increasing philanthropy, and more industrial reorganization, however good in and of themselves, will not remedy the facts of birth and the accidents of living. Only comprehension of facts and wise manipulation within the laws of nature will enable man to get what he wants and to avoid what he does not want. Scientific knowledge, leading to scientific action, is the only antidote for so-called accidental ills.

86:7.5 (957.1) Industry, war, slavery, and civil government arose in response to the social evolution of man in his natural environment; religion similarly arose as his response to the illusory environment of the imaginary ghost world. Religion was an evolutionary development of self-maintenance, and it has worked, notwithstanding that it was originally erroneous in concept and utterly illogical.

86:7.6 (957.2) Primitive religion prepared the soil of the human mind, by the powerful and awesome force of false fear, for the bestowal of a bona fide spiritual force of supernatural origin, the Thought Adjuster. And the divine Adjusters have ever since labored to transmute God-fear into God-love. Evolution may be slow, but it is unerringly effective.

86:7.7 (957.3) [Presented by an Evening Star of Nebadon.]


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:44 am +0000
Posts: 617
Location: thailand
a bit off topic - just watched Ancient Apocalypse with Graham Hancock today on Netflix - got the 10800bc Younger Dryas thing figured out - as reading the UB - was a big jump in the time frame on the planet -
Bradley - let me know - but reading the UB - 10000bc to 5000bc is really empty - big skip on the history - but 10800bc - the Taurid meteor strem hit earth - northern hemisphere - 12+ days of metoer strikes that hit the notherrn ice sheet/wall that came down to northern usa - blew up the nothern ice sheet and caused the global flood - then 1000 yrs of global cooling - Gobekli Tepi made in 9600 bc after the flood waters receeded
https://phys.org/news/2019-05-potential ... swarm.html
Taurid meteor stream goes close to earth twice every year - june and november - ifsome meteor hits at 10800bc hit the ice sheet and caused the flooding - gets closer to earth twice every 26000 years
anyway - explains a lot of the missing UB history I have been looking for - as 9600 bc to 5000-4000 bc history seems to be missing from the UB
aarrgghh
joe rogan and graham handcock on the subject
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PC78KblS3jo


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted:  
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:29 am +0000
Posts: 6039
I am watching the same series right now too!!

Actually, I have found the first 3 episodes to specifically answer eerily to track the UB presentation of the Andite global migrations presented in Paper 79. The UB offers a very robust historical timelinein Papers 78-81.

I'll look into your dates of interest and see what I find.

https://www.urantia.org/urantia-book/se ... &op=Search

https://www.urantia.org/urantia-book/se ... &op=Search

8)

_________________
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 942 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Registered users: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group